Home Forums General Karting Discussion 2-stroke EFI: is it in the pipeline for karting?

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    • #87069
      Spencer Uzri
      Participant

      KTM & Husqvarna have overcome the technical hurdles, & are releasing 2-stroke EFI engine off road bikes this year.  A primary motivation for this evolution is that the engines must meet impending Euro 5 emissions regs.  Again, these models are marketed for off road use.

      So, if Euro emissions laws apply to karting as well, does that mean that EFI is eventually coming?  I’ve heard that TM has a prototype in the lab, & there was a Modena EFI prototype displayed back in 2014, but it never came to market.

    • #87089
      William Martin
      Participant

      Don’t know, you can do it now if you want to spend the money. See: <http://www.ecotrons.com/products/2_stroke_small_engine_fuel_injection_kit/&gt;

      Of course, unless it’s available to all as a bolt on kit, it’ll never see approval from any sanctioning body…

      This is not a “clean” EFI either, doesn’t get rid of the intake/exhaust cross flow issue.

      -bill

    • #87212
      Spencer Uzri
      Participant

      I’m aware of that kit, but it doesn’t meet the Euro4 mandate, which is the driving point of my question.  If emissions mandates will be applied to off (public) road vehicles, of which karts are a subset, then are true 2-stroke EFI (ie. case & transfer port injectors) engines inevitably in the future of karting?

      • #87274
        William Martin
        Participant

        Hmm, I sure hope politicians/regulators don’t start considering karts as “off-road vehicles”, as opposed to pure racing vehicles. Please don’t encourage that line of thought! :-) It could be very dangerous to the future of karting.

        -bill

    • #87324
      Matt Martin
      Participant

      I think being afraid of change to modern solutions which are well-proven, and well-documented pose a threat to the future of most things – karting very much included.

       

      Think about it, no more carbs with 3 jets, various needles, and knobs.  No more carb rebuilds.  That sounds wonderful!  More driving and less cost messing about and having to have $300 in carb-tuning equipment to be competitive.

      • #87347
        William Martin
        Participant

        Not about being afraid of change, just not wanting some bureaucrat dictating the terms. I would personally love to see a good fuel injection package for karts, but don’t think I want it designed by a lawyer. Cost IS a factor here, mass market emissions specs could well kill the whole thing.

        -bill

         

    • #87476
      Matt Martin
      Participant

      Grassroots motorsports have generally been exempt from emissions regulations, i see no reason why that wouldn’t continue.

       

      However, in the unfortunate circumstance that regulations get applied to karting, all karts of X or Y class would be bound by the same regulations, and I still see EFI as the way forward.

       

      US karting tends to follow euro karting to a large extent, and I can see that trend continuing.

    • #87479
      Glenn L Riggs
      Participant

      You think you pay alot for carb work wait till you have to have someone program you ecu. Mapping would have to be sealed an would be hard to enforce. To get people involved in the sport we have to keep costs down. There are all sorts of things that could update our karts but isn`t needed. Not a fan of the L 206 but is going in the right direction imagine if you had to pay for F I? Just my thought

      • #87486
        William Martin
        Participant

        Why would mapping have to be sealed? Is your carb sealed now? Would that be a good thing?

    • #87518
      Bryan Williams
      Participant

      To hit on what Glen said, I agree tunes would have to have some sort of standard or efi tuneres and their costs will be crazy. Also do you limit the size of the injectors. I like the idea of EFI motors but opening up a huge can of worms

    • #87536
      Matt Martin
      Participant

      limit fuel flow (via a spec pump).  CIK homologates everything else, i’m not sure why they wouldn’t do the same with the all of the EFI components – ECU, injector, and intake dimensions.

       

       

      Also, people have learned to tune carbs, why wouldn’t the regular person learn to adjust injector duty cycle (assuming ignitions remain as they are)?

    • #87537
      Spencer Uzri
      Participant

      Not about being afraid of change, just not wanting some bureaucrat dictating the terms. I would personally love to see a good fuel injection package for karts, but don’t think I want it designed by a lawyer. Cost IS a factor here, mass market emissions specs could well kill the whole thing. -bill

      Bureaucrats are already dictating.  That’s why KTM & Husqvarna have applied EFI to their 2-strokes.  Let’s be frank about this: there is general push against IC engines, with 2-strokes being the red-headed half sibling in the family.  I think this could be a trend, if for no other reason than Europe is the hub of karting, & Europe loves to regulate.

      Of course, you do know that by law, IC engine cars will be banned starting in 2040 in the UK, right?  Do you really expect such a sweeping change won’t have a wider, “inadvertent” ripple effect?  If the storage density limitation of batteries can be resolved, then this will be a nonissue, & ekarting will take on a whole new meaning.

    • #87547
      Matt Martin
      Participant

      If the storage density limitation of batteries can be resolved, then this will be a nonissue, & ekarting will take on a whole new meaning.

       

      Thrilled for the prospect of this.

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