Where is Cesar Rull?

Greg Wright · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:07 pm Post subject:

This presents a good argument for licensing. You would have to work your way up the ladder in order to get into a higher performance class. This works well in many forms of motorsport and would keep people from going right straight to a class of kart that is over the heads.

I think this is a good idea but it's never gonna happen.
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Paul Makarucha · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:30 pm Post subject:

I'm all for licensing. It beats the current approach of licensing via budget.
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Greg Cavouras · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:30 pm Post subject:

John Matthews · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:18 pm Post subject:

Great system but in the US with so many different organizations and track owners it won't happen because somebody else will always let you drive what you want.

If we can get to the point where people wanted to go for a true national championship, and you could only accumulate points at tracks that stuck to the system, and all the local clubs wanted to be affiliated, and the importers wanted to see Americans climb the ladder and compete in Europe, and the local shops had enough business servicing existing racers that they didn't need to sell shifters to novices, and the racers and potential racers could see the advantage of a licensing system, and the insurance companies mandated it....

Then you might see a licensing system take hold in US karting.

But until then local clubs can do their part by nurturing their novice/sportsman classes. Clubs and track owners can mandate a certain level of experience before drivers could move up in class, this wouldn't be as difficult as some people think and many racers would actually welcome it. Maybe even the insurance companies could be persuaded to give discounts to clubs that have these requirements.

A more comprehensive approach to licensing and qualifying drivers would be helpful in US karting but any changes will pretty much have to come from the clubs and track owners, the national structure is just to fragmented IMHO. Maybe a track officials section on EKN????

Cheers,
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Chris Reinhardt · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:36 pm Post subject:

I believe the WKA still has such a system for the road race series...

You have to race 100cc or less for a year, before they will let you run anything bigger.

Also in the auto world, there's many different org's, they all have very similar licensing systems, so I don't think that's an issue.

CR
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Ken Schilling · Joined: 01 Dec 2005 Posts: 1341

Alex King · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:06 pm Post subject:

...and what about Ace...did he quit too?

Brian Degulis · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:22 pm Post subject:

Cesar didn't try to fool anyone he represented himself as a newbie right from the start. The only advise I remember him discarding and pushing back at was to get a TAG kart and he only pushed back on that after it was reapeted over and over. I'm not sure how you can conclude that he got out because he got in over his head when he never ran the kart. He may have been over his head in trying to put something together himself but wether it was TAG or shifter wouldn't have made much diffrence.

The whole idea that I'm mad because I gave advise that wasn't followed and then the guy drops out doesn't make much sense to me. If your mad because you put in a few moments of time and your advise was ignored then why waste so much more time complaining about it or knocking the guy?

Licensing Holy crap Does anyone think that would draw more people to the sport?

If you look at whats for sale there it isn't like they're all high end late model shifters it's everything from box stock on up. It may just be that for some it's an impulse buy and they wouldn't last regardles of what they bought.

Brian

Jimmy McNeil · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:06 pm Post subject:

Alex King · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:15 pm Post subject:

Yes. He should have bought the SwedeTech bottom end when I made it available to him...but you did instead...ha!

Gary M Smith · Posted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:48 pm Post subject:

Cesar seems like your typical guy who sees people having fun karting, he thinks he can do the same. Instead of starting at the bottom of the food chain, he wants to start at the top, realizing he has bittin off more than he can chew, he decides to sell his equipment.
I , like many drivers started out small, just wanted to have fun, not to be the fastest guy out there, but just having fun, learning how your racing machine responds to changes. Gradually getting faster and more powerful engines, you go faster, learn how to handle the kart with more precission. No longer are you going off track, but looking to better your previous lap time at that track.
Good luck Cesar
Gary
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Tim Pappas · Joined: 25 Jul 2001 Posts: 792 Location: Burkina Faso,

If someone asks for advice he gets 3 different sets of advice from 3 different keyboard experts. If he chooses none or one of opinions, then there are 2-3 butt hurt so called helpers who then call the advice seeker an idiot.

Not sayin' that CZor wasn't a tool, just sayin' that people get way too caught up in wanting their advice to be the "right" advice. There are a number of people giving advice just so everyone can see just how smart they are. They are just as much of a tool as CZor.

Just sayin'

Chris Reinhardt · Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 6:47 am Post subject:

John Matthews · Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 8:13 am Post subject:

I suspect what frustrates people is not when their advice is ignored but when a forum member who is completely new to the sport states, or implies that everyone else is wrong and they know better than the collective knowledge presented.

The true beauty of computer forums is the power of the collective mind. In the old days you had to rely on what the guy running the shop or the guys at your track said. Now you have the ability to get opinions from all over the world, from experienced people as well as those with only a little more knowledge than yourself. You can also look at all the posts from a specific person and decide if you like their advice or not.

In this case there are a few people that started out in shifter karts who are happy they did, and a whole bunch of people that advise against it. I think I can make a pretty convincing argument that those who started with shifters and are still on this forum represent a pretty small minority with the vast majority of people starting in shifters dropping out of the sport thus not being a part of the discussion here having moved on to other hobbies. And, there are probably just as many folks who started big and downgraded on this forum as there are who stayed in shifters and are happy they did.

I think we can all agree that visiting local tracks and shops is a good idea before you decide what equipment to get no matter what. I wasn't offended when Cesar told me I was wrong about him, I did however find it offensive when he bashed his local shop for trying to steer him in a direction that would have a better chance of keeping him in the sport for more than a week. I also found it humorous when he tried to explain how he was going to transport his new kart (the one he didn't even have yet) on top of his car and store it in his apartment.

The people who post on this forum really do want others to be involved in the sport at a level that makes sense for them. That's why we continue to try to help even those who make it clear they don't want to listen no matter what. Hopefully others who are merely reading (there are huge numbers of lurkers out there) will take the time to search out a few threads on topics that concern them and come to the forum, and the sport with a little more knowledge than they would have otherwise. The only reason any of us are where we are is because of the collective efforts of those that went before us. We are truly "standing on the shoulders of giants" Smile

Cheers,
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Walter Kaihatu · Joined: 28 Mar 2011 Posts: 41

I would agree with John's post above. I "lurked" the posts on this subject and saw it was not going to go well. Ultimately I thinks it's just the human condition: someone asked for advice, we take the time to give them "our best stuff" then the person asking does the opposite or continues to ask the same questions of someone else. As it relates to this forum, just know what even though the person asking in the first place did not do anything with the knowledge, someone out there reading the string of posts did and hopefully a new racer was born!

Just the other day a really cool dad called me and asked for advice. After giving him my best stuff he said thanks and that he was going to ask some more folks for their opinion. Bemused? For sure. Either way if someone is going to honor me by asking, I'll keep giving them my best stuff even if they do something else. What else are we going to do with all this great knowledge rattling around our brains?

Have a great 2013.

Walter